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	Comments on: Is it okay to use a green tea extract to assist in weight loss?	</title>
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	<description>Moral answers to everyday concerns, curiosities, and uncertainties.  Gramps considers all questions on all topics from all sources.</description>
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		<title>
		By: PeterPriesthood80		</title>
		<link>https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35923</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[PeterPriesthood80]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Aug 2017 00:18:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://en.elds.org/askgramps-org/?p=37903#comment-35923</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I have to say something here because the definitions are incorrect and thus are distorting what is real. Nobody becomes addicted to caffeine and anyone who states otherwise doesn&#039;t know what they&#039;re talking about. Addiction is when a user&#039;s dependence is at a level where that person is willing to sacrifice the stability of their life by such behaviors as breaking the law, contracting an incurable serious illness (HIV, Hepatitis), putting your life on the line, destroying close relationships in order to satisfy said addiction. When someone says they can&#039;t function without their cup of coffee in the morning is using a figure of speech and is hardly addicted. They may have developed a slight dependency on caffeine as evidenced by a headache of some sort when caffeine is not present in their system or even an emotional or habitual dependence but certainly not an addiction; by definition. My whole comment is to be clear that nobody gets addicted to caffeine. Addiction is a serious word and thus carries serious connotations and definitions and we must be careful not to throw it around.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to say something here because the definitions are incorrect and thus are distorting what is real. Nobody becomes addicted to caffeine and anyone who states otherwise doesn&#8217;t know what they&#8217;re talking about. Addiction is when a user&#8217;s dependence is at a level where that person is willing to sacrifice the stability of their life by such behaviors as breaking the law, contracting an incurable serious illness (HIV, Hepatitis), putting your life on the line, destroying close relationships in order to satisfy said addiction. When someone says they can&#8217;t function without their cup of coffee in the morning is using a figure of speech and is hardly addicted. They may have developed a slight dependency on caffeine as evidenced by a headache of some sort when caffeine is not present in their system or even an emotional or habitual dependence but certainly not an addiction; by definition. My whole comment is to be clear that nobody gets addicted to caffeine. Addiction is a serious word and thus carries serious connotations and definitions and we must be careful not to throw it around.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Rae H.		</title>
		<link>https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35913</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Rae H.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Aug 2017 07:29:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://en.elds.org/askgramps-org/?p=37903#comment-35913</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35902&quot;&gt;Mormon_Joe&lt;/a&gt;.

Hot drinks were clarified by further revelation specifically as coffee, tea, alcohol, and tobacco. Caffeine was a known word at the time the Word of Wisdom was revealed, but it was not used. Caffeine is also very present in chocolate, but again, this was also not mentioned. For us to attempt to interpret, beyond what was revealed, as what the Lord REALLY meant, is reaching beyond the mark. We should not seek to counsel the Lord on His own commandments.

We know the hard line is here: No coffee, tea, alcohol, and tobacco. Beyond that, it is not good for men to be commanded in all things. We are encouraged to pursue further light and knowledge through inspiration and personal revelation.

Personal revelation is PERSONAL. It relates to you, alone. We should in no way attempt to educate, persuade, or call our brothers and sisters to repentance for things we feel have been revealed to us, beyond what is declared by our holy prophets and apostles.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35902">Mormon_Joe</a>.</p>
<p>Hot drinks were clarified by further revelation specifically as coffee, tea, alcohol, and tobacco. Caffeine was a known word at the time the Word of Wisdom was revealed, but it was not used. Caffeine is also very present in chocolate, but again, this was also not mentioned. For us to attempt to interpret, beyond what was revealed, as what the Lord REALLY meant, is reaching beyond the mark. We should not seek to counsel the Lord on His own commandments.</p>
<p>We know the hard line is here: No coffee, tea, alcohol, and tobacco. Beyond that, it is not good for men to be commanded in all things. We are encouraged to pursue further light and knowledge through inspiration and personal revelation.</p>
<p>Personal revelation is PERSONAL. It relates to you, alone. We should in no way attempt to educate, persuade, or call our brothers and sisters to repentance for things we feel have been revealed to us, beyond what is declared by our holy prophets and apostles.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Noah Riding		</title>
		<link>https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35908</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Noah Riding]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Aug 2017 05:40:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://en.elds.org/askgramps-org/?p=37903#comment-35908</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I think if you study it out in your mind and pray about it you will come to the right answer. 

That being said, I find it disturbing that a lot of people are coming up with exceptions to almost every word of wisdom item now. I don&#039;t think that&#039;s the way the Lord wants it. He knows that people try to put other people into bondage to live over them. 

Just yesterday I ran into some comments by someone on another site how they didn&#039;t think marijauna was that bad, and had a clever reason, and it was OK as long as they were in control. How foolish! As if we are always in control? We&#039;re never in control of our lives. Even the most basic thing such as holding a job we depend on Heavenly Father. 

I wanted to basically speak up for not creating exceptions to the word of wisdom. That&#039;s not what Heavenly Father wants. This is how people run into the slippery slope. Then they fall sliding down it. They do so because they thought that they could never be in danger as long as they had a clever reason on why it was OK. In other words they never took the danger seriously from the beginning, just because &quot;if tobacco is for sick cattle, then marijauna is for people with real pain. I&#039;m in pain so it must be OK.&quot; 

So many people are actually defending bending of the rules of the word of wisdom too. This is proof that there&#039;s trouble with it among people who are church members. 

Now back to your issue. I don&#039;t think I need to say much, but green tea is powerful. If you talk to restaurant owners they will tell you when they serve tea that the STEEL tea pots they use get eaten through literally by the tannic acid in green tea and others in a mild period of time. I had a conversation with an old boss like this once; though at the moment I forgot how long she told it takes for the steel tea pot to get eaten through. And I saw the pot too.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think if you study it out in your mind and pray about it you will come to the right answer. </p>
<p>That being said, I find it disturbing that a lot of people are coming up with exceptions to almost every word of wisdom item now. I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s the way the Lord wants it. He knows that people try to put other people into bondage to live over them. </p>
<p>Just yesterday I ran into some comments by someone on another site how they didn&#8217;t think marijauna was that bad, and had a clever reason, and it was OK as long as they were in control. How foolish! As if we are always in control? We&#8217;re never in control of our lives. Even the most basic thing such as holding a job we depend on Heavenly Father. </p>
<p>I wanted to basically speak up for not creating exceptions to the word of wisdom. That&#8217;s not what Heavenly Father wants. This is how people run into the slippery slope. Then they fall sliding down it. They do so because they thought that they could never be in danger as long as they had a clever reason on why it was OK. In other words they never took the danger seriously from the beginning, just because &#8220;if tobacco is for sick cattle, then marijauna is for people with real pain. I&#8217;m in pain so it must be OK.&#8221; </p>
<p>So many people are actually defending bending of the rules of the word of wisdom too. This is proof that there&#8217;s trouble with it among people who are church members. </p>
<p>Now back to your issue. I don&#8217;t think I need to say much, but green tea is powerful. If you talk to restaurant owners they will tell you when they serve tea that the STEEL tea pots they use get eaten through literally by the tannic acid in green tea and others in a mild period of time. I had a conversation with an old boss like this once; though at the moment I forgot how long she told it takes for the steel tea pot to get eaten through. And I saw the pot too.</p>
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		<title>
		By: alan_swenson		</title>
		<link>https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35904</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[alan_swenson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Aug 2017 17:45:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://en.elds.org/askgramps-org/?p=37903#comment-35904</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35902&quot;&gt;Mormon_Joe&lt;/a&gt;.

No, it&#039;s not being a slothful servant at all, it&#039;s being an actual follower, instead of one who just relies on tradition and not true doctrine or policy. This is a huge problem in the church today - members don&#039;t actually study church handbooks, guidelines, policies, etc. Members just do what their parents did, what their friends do. And the worst part about it is that those members impose those traditions as if they were doctrine on others, judging others by how much they follow the traditions. A few simple examples - there is no church policy that says that every Mormon man must wear a white shirt to church, yet when someone wears a colored shirt he is given questioning looks, people make judgements (often subconsciously) about that man because he&#039;s being different. The same goes for Mormon men with facial hair. And obviously that&#039;s all much worse in Utah (I don&#039;t live in Utah anymore). I once had an Elder&#039;s Quorum President (outside of Utah) who made a point to often not wear white. I once had a High Councilman (also outside of Utah) who refused to shave his goatee because nothing required him to shave it. But most of us are so focused on tradition (my parents didn&#039;t drink caffeine, and my friends say it&#039;s bad, so I need to tell everyone else it&#039;s bad and judge those who drink it)... It would do us good to remember that the traditions of their fathers lead to both the Jews rejecting Christ and also to the continual wickedness of the Lamanites. 
I prefer to follow Christ and his appointed church leaders, and the actual doctrines and polices of the church (which first means you have to know the actual doctrines and polices of the church), rather than the imposed doctrines of Mormon culture.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35902">Mormon_Joe</a>.</p>
<p>No, it&#8217;s not being a slothful servant at all, it&#8217;s being an actual follower, instead of one who just relies on tradition and not true doctrine or policy. This is a huge problem in the church today &#8211; members don&#8217;t actually study church handbooks, guidelines, policies, etc. Members just do what their parents did, what their friends do. And the worst part about it is that those members impose those traditions as if they were doctrine on others, judging others by how much they follow the traditions. A few simple examples &#8211; there is no church policy that says that every Mormon man must wear a white shirt to church, yet when someone wears a colored shirt he is given questioning looks, people make judgements (often subconsciously) about that man because he&#8217;s being different. The same goes for Mormon men with facial hair. And obviously that&#8217;s all much worse in Utah (I don&#8217;t live in Utah anymore). I once had an Elder&#8217;s Quorum President (outside of Utah) who made a point to often not wear white. I once had a High Councilman (also outside of Utah) who refused to shave his goatee because nothing required him to shave it. But most of us are so focused on tradition (my parents didn&#8217;t drink caffeine, and my friends say it&#8217;s bad, so I need to tell everyone else it&#8217;s bad and judge those who drink it)&#8230; It would do us good to remember that the traditions of their fathers lead to both the Jews rejecting Christ and also to the continual wickedness of the Lamanites.<br />
I prefer to follow Christ and his appointed church leaders, and the actual doctrines and polices of the church (which first means you have to know the actual doctrines and polices of the church), rather than the imposed doctrines of Mormon culture.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mormon_Joe		</title>
		<link>https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35902</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mormon_Joe]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Aug 2017 07:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://en.elds.org/askgramps-org/?p=37903#comment-35902</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[In reply to &lt;a href=&quot;https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35895&quot;&gt;alan_swenson&lt;/a&gt;.

Slothful servant much? What it says is it that caffeine wasn&#039;t mentioned specifically and that the text does read, &quot;hot drinks.&quot;  It does not spell out in black and white that caffeine is or is not appropriate for consumption, but that they currently teach about tea and coffee.  For that matter cocaine is not mentioned either, and it stimulates the same part of the brain caffeine does. So why not?  And I suppose that iced coffee or tea is ok then?  That said, common replacements of the time to help people quit alcohol were tea and coffee (which was more patriotic, because tea is too British;  Look up the puritan movement of the 1800s), which may be from where those specifics originate.    Additionally one historical definition of &quot;hot&quot; at the time also meant stimulating.  It is worth considering that it was likely that tea and coffee were seen as medicinal, for occasional use as a medicine, but not regular use.  There is a lot more to this, but I am keeping it brief.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In reply to <a href="https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35895">alan_swenson</a>.</p>
<p>Slothful servant much? What it says is it that caffeine wasn&#8217;t mentioned specifically and that the text does read, &#8220;hot drinks.&#8221;  It does not spell out in black and white that caffeine is or is not appropriate for consumption, but that they currently teach about tea and coffee.  For that matter cocaine is not mentioned either, and it stimulates the same part of the brain caffeine does. So why not?  And I suppose that iced coffee or tea is ok then?  That said, common replacements of the time to help people quit alcohol were tea and coffee (which was more patriotic, because tea is too British;  Look up the puritan movement of the 1800s), which may be from where those specifics originate.    Additionally one historical definition of &#8220;hot&#8221; at the time also meant stimulating.  It is worth considering that it was likely that tea and coffee were seen as medicinal, for occasional use as a medicine, but not regular use.  There is a lot more to this, but I am keeping it brief.</p>
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		<title>
		By: haroldthehiker		</title>
		<link>https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35897</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[haroldthehiker]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Aug 2017 22:45:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://en.elds.org/askgramps-org/?p=37903#comment-35897</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[in someone&#039;s recent post about the WOW, it said that having a (caffeinated drink) won&#039;t keep you from a recommend, but, &#039;i really need it, it&#039;s an addiction&#039;...which is probably the point in the first place...]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>in someone&#8217;s recent post about the WOW, it said that having a (caffeinated drink) won&#8217;t keep you from a recommend, but, &#8216;i really need it, it&#8217;s an addiction&#8217;&#8230;which is probably the point in the first place&#8230;</p>
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		<title>
		By: alan_swenson		</title>
		<link>https://askgramps.org/okay-green-tea-extract-weight-loss/#comment-35895</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[alan_swenson]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Aug 2017 03:50:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://en.elds.org/askgramps-org/?p=37903#comment-35895</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[The specific topic of caffeine and the Word of Wisdom was address in a Mormon Newsroom article back in 2012. That makes it pretty official - caffeine is NOT against the Word of Wisdom.

&quot;Finally, another small correction: Despite what was reported, the Church revelation spelling out health practices (Doctrine and Covenants 89) does not mention the use of caffeine.  The Church’s health guidelines prohibit alcoholic drinks, smoking or chewing of tobacco, and “hot drinks” — taught by Church leaders to refer specifically to tea and coffee.&quot;
http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/mormonism-news--getting-it-right-august-29

The question that often then gets asked is &quot;why tea and coffee?&quot;, and the answer is &quot;we don&#039;t know&quot;. We have never been given a reason why tea and coffee are prohibited. But people (generally speaking) have a hard time following something that doesn&#039;t have a justification. So we try to find what tea and coffee have in common - caffeine. And then we extrapolate out from there. And that is what leads to a lot of problems (with more than just the Word of Wisdom). It&#039;s not that we don&#039;t have official direction from church leaders, it&#039;s that we make up our own reasons and then extend that beyond what was actually given, and start holding others to and judging others based on our own interpretations.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The specific topic of caffeine and the Word of Wisdom was address in a Mormon Newsroom article back in 2012. That makes it pretty official &#8211; caffeine is NOT against the Word of Wisdom.</p>
<p>&#8220;Finally, another small correction: Despite what was reported, the Church revelation spelling out health practices (Doctrine and Covenants 89) does not mention the use of caffeine.  The Church’s health guidelines prohibit alcoholic drinks, smoking or chewing of tobacco, and “hot drinks” — taught by Church leaders to refer specifically to tea and coffee.&#8221;<br />
<a href="http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/mormonism-news--getting-it-right-august-29" rel="nofollow ugc">http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/mormonism-news&#8211;getting-it-right-august-29</a></p>
<p>The question that often then gets asked is &#8220;why tea and coffee?&#8221;, and the answer is &#8220;we don&#8217;t know&#8221;. We have never been given a reason why tea and coffee are prohibited. But people (generally speaking) have a hard time following something that doesn&#8217;t have a justification. So we try to find what tea and coffee have in common &#8211; caffeine. And then we extrapolate out from there. And that is what leads to a lot of problems (with more than just the Word of Wisdom). It&#8217;s not that we don&#8217;t have official direction from church leaders, it&#8217;s that we make up our own reasons and then extend that beyond what was actually given, and start holding others to and judging others based on our own interpretations.</p>
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